Discipleship Groups

 People go to a church even a Pentecostal one with set expectations.

There's the head man .

There's the service we pay for .

Any change is disruptive .

Half a century ago we were getting excited about discipleship. In order to do it Juan Carlos Ortiz had to secretly take 12 aside .

Then came the discipleship books .

Then came the home groups.

Jesus Move did the house churches then they grew into self standing visible churches .

But we still have a problem. And mainly it's that there's three stages of growth and charismatics are still in denial about 1 John 2, and the inner work of Romans 6 and 7.

That's what Watchman Nee Normal Christian Life and Sit Walk Stand attempted .

Norman Grubb did a better more accurate version without the black and white dog. Readers will get this .

GH Warnock brought out the ecclesia aspect and moving through the three Feasts in the Spirit .

So that's the real " discipleship dilemma ".

People haven't lived Bible House ...the cheek by jowl learning of the disciples in the gospels.

How much do those running Bible House community houses know Galatians 2.20 and Mark 16 supernatural praying in ministry?

The 12 learned whole of Life living in the Father and ministry in the Spirit from Jesus .

Roffey and Colin Urquart and Bob Gordon attempted both using Kings Buses and ' students ' who were with them to learn .

As soon as you say the student word that comes with Geeek learning baggage.

Kingdom is zöe. It has a whole of Life Galatians 2.20 side ....and it has a priesthood side.

Our generation felt embarrassed by those who said we should be evangelising more.

It does seem to be a window thing .

Moravians prayed 100 years .....I bet they were criticised. Jesusc.....that's God in human form ....the One who co created everything....spent 30 years not evangelising.

This shows how deep was the 4000 year reset after the Fall , for Jesus to be grounded in living in the Father when everybody else was doing Genesis 3 lie living.

But it's also Testimony of the subtlety of Satan's wrath state lie .....if it took God that long in human form .

So we are a royal priesthood.

We are king overcomers in training .

We are trainees in a priestly protocol of bringing in the reign of God.

The rather flippant thing called House groups or cell groups.....a kind of Methodist class meeting updated to charismatic sessions .....it's still nowhere near what ecclesia is .

I don't know what others feel....but evangelists now return to the original gospel of repentance, baptism in water and being filled with the Spirit .

Pastor gifts.....not the one man overlord misuse of the word......are plural and have the gifting to bed people into the Romans truths .

Do pastors have the ability take people in the Spirit from Romans 3 to 5 into Romans 6 and 7?

What we found was the most enormous hidden key areas of lives ....my own included .....would come right to the surface hopefully in a safe environment. Since ....as the circumcised Penis is the Old Covenant logo ....quietly telling us Romans 6 and 7 is a scary area .....because its the raw seat of our desires .....not just sex by the way

Raw desires to dominate

Raw desires to make money at all cost....Judas syndrome

Just put Raw in front of anything you can think of. Its force is frightening. Debilitating in force .

But this is how we learn firsthand what the Genesis 3 lie is . That there's only 2 masters .

The third doesn't exist spiritually. Me in the middle.

That's why , although we have to go through the Holy place realm , the transition realm , the Pentecostal Charismatic realm ....it is still fake .

I don't hear charismatic ministries off the middle man delusion .

When Lyall Peluso was teaching Romans 6 40 years ago it was almost received as a heretic gospel. We had to go to Brighton to hear him .

Third level sounds heretical because our consciousness is 6000 years of conditioning into the independent self powered soul living for Christ .

Nope....there's a whole unnecessary layer in that theology .

The separate me .

There never was a separate me. The Devil me .

Jesus me . But never in 6000 years me me .

There's no me living for Christ . The whole charismatic belief system is a lie .

There's no adding the Holy Spirit to my life lived for Jesus .

People complain....I'm living my life for the Lord but all these things are happening.

We aren't meant to be living our life for the Lord since our funeral. Its scary seeing a ghost live for Jesus .

We are spirit.

We have a soul .

Our former spiritman was sold under sin .

Think of Genesis 3 as a cross between a Freemason oath and a slave sale at an old market .

We can choose a new master , but the sale has been made . Our soul and spirit has an indwelling yukky tyrant spirit . We in Adam signed the agreement in the one forbidden fruit .

Jesus annulled the deal by killing us in His Body and raising us as a rope twined , interlaced Colossians 3.3 being .

We aren't living for Jesus at all . Christ is living co- fused to our spirit man in one of four Matthew Mark Luke John or Meyers Briggs 16 blend flavours. When we pray in tongues our real inner person is praying without the rude butler who claims to be the lord of the manor but he's mere serving staff ....my natural mind .

When Paul says we must set the mind on the Spirit for that is life and peace, it's because that's the real us . Its not just some religious woo woo practice.

To set the mind on the flesh if you put it onto a graph, with a vertical line up the middle which is God's life ......well flesh is either to the left of the line or the right side of the line .....but it's not what God is actually doing.

Religion is the Tree of Good but it's still the delusion of the independent self living for God in various orphan appeasement ways .

The other side is the Evil end of the Tree but that's obvious .

All this is discipleship.

It's related to 1 John 2 child stage young man stage father stage

It's related to the Seal .....the Father knowing , having intimate relation with all of us and with us departing from iniquity . Iniquity is the Deep 6000 year hold on us ....freed in spirit in New Birth but our souls haven't made the adjustments.

It's related to the last 3 stages of MScott Pecks four stages of psychological growth

It's related to Maslows hierarchy of needs....except genuine kinging in the Spirit not just an earthly ability to create pyramid shapes with us at the top.

It's related to psalm 84....

finding our strength in Him

In whose hearts are the highway to Jesus central

Proven track record with places of weeping turned round

Recognised in the spirit in front of God and man .

See what I mean by flippant little groups?

Jesus was building City on a Hill that actually worked .

There is currently no City on a Hill ecclesia holding open heaven over a place .

We can just about arrange a few months of Lakeland or Asbury ....usually outside the City Gates of pyramid infrastructure

Or

5 day conferences which begin to look similar.

But there aren't enough thirdlevellers yet , and even when the Ern Baxters emerge they aren't used to miracles. The 12 apostles were doing the whole stuff because Jesus also had the 30 year background.