Showing posts with label Annelize Mouton. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Annelize Mouton. Show all posts

Saturday, 14 February 2015

Job part 2 - The Righteousness of Job - Annalize Mouton



I have searched the Lord's heart on "death to self" or "dying to self" now for quite a long time, and this is what He has shown me: Job was a man who had completely died to a selfhood apart from God. He was alive only to a God that he knew to be his friend and through whose goodness alone, he was clothed with His righteousness. And if you think that Job didn't know about that, please read and then resolve within yourself to once and forever not know yourself or any other person after the flesh, but only after His spirit within them!

If you remove the yoke from your midst, the pointing of the finger, then…your light will break out like the dawn, and your recovery will speedily spring forth; and your righteousness will go before you; the glory of the LORD will be your rear guard. Then you will call, and the LORD will answer; you will cry, and He will say, 'Here I am.'

If we do not put on the righteousness of God, everything in our lives will run out. The same as happened to the prodigal. Our finances, our health, our wisdom, our strength, whatever we considered to be ours. We have to return to our Father/our Origin and be clothed upon with Himself, His life, His Righteousness, His garment, and live in His abundance of life and everything else. Where does this returning (repentance) happen? In our minds, our awareness, consciousness, our thinking and eventually the words we speak and the works we do. For us to enjoy the full benefits of our Father’s house we need to have our consciences purged by fire of the dead works of our wandering-years and the resulting shame and guilt. When we return, we find that our Father has all the time been waiting for us, and He comes running towards us with outstretched arms and is not even interested in us confessing our sins or becoming his servants. Why? Because in His mind we are, has been and always will be His very own beloved children, made in His image and likeness. If that was not the absolute, unshakeable TRUTH, Adam and Eve would have been put to death immediately, and God would just have had to start all over with creating another man. The blood of goats and bulls could never take away sin, and it never did. Our God is terribly fearsome in His fiery Holiness and I really do not think we have even caught a tiny glimpse of that yet. Just think about all the preparations and coverings and sacrifices needed for service in and entering the tabernacle of Moses! All to allow frail human beings like us to come into His Manifested Presence/a Pillar of Fire/Thunderings and Lightnings. In His presence no sin can be and no sinful person can ever stand – we all would be fried to crisp and ashes immediately. Think about it. After Adam and Eve sinned, they knew they’ve had it! They had lost their light covering and were desperately trying to cover themselves with something so as not to be annihilated immediately! Yet, here comes God as usual, in the cool of the day (hear what these words are saying of Him who is a consuming fire, eternal burning) and He seeks them out! He calls for them, as if they had never sinned! And as He covers them so that they might be able to stand upright in His presence again, they found out that He has had a covering prepared for them – His own spotless Life Blood, Lamb, Jesus Christ slain before the foundation of the earth. The cross on which sin died in the heart of Father God even before He made man.

Now, take another look at Job: There is what God says and continues to say about Job right through until the end. Then we also read what satan says about him, his friends, and Job himself. God’s word about Job – to satan in the heavenly court, to Job’s friends and eventually to Job himself, and Job's own words about himself and God somehow line up (agree):

In the land of Uz there lived a man whose name was Job. This man was blameless and upright; he feared God and shunned evil.

God: 1:8 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”

God: 2:3 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil. And he still maintains his integrity, though you incited me against him to ruin him without any reason.” (He has kept his faith in me despite the fact that you persuaded me to let you harm him without any cause.)

Eliphaz: 5:8 “If I were you, I would go to God and confess my sins (present my case) to him.

Job: 6:29 “Desist now, let there be no injustice; even desist, my righteousness is yet in it.”

Bildad: 8:6 If you are pure and upright, surely now He would rouse Himself for you and restore your righteous estate.

Zophar: 11:4 you have said, ‘My teaching is pure, and I am innocent in your eyes.’

Job: 12:4 I am a joke to my friends, the one who called on God and He answered him; the just and blameless man is a joke.

Job: 13:15 Nevertheless, I am going to argue my case with Him. This at least will be in my favour, that I am not godless, to be instantly rejected from His presence. …This is my case: I know that I am righteous.

Eliphaz: 15:14 What is man, that he should be clean? and he which is born of a woman, that he should be righteous?

Job: 16:17 Even now my witness is in heaven; my advocate is on high. My intercessor is my friend as my eyes pour out tears to God; on behalf of a man he pleads with God as one pleads for a friend.

Job: 17:13 and 14 (Now remember here that the name Job also means Who is my Father?) If I say to corruption (death), ‘You are my father,’ and to the worm, ‘My mother’ or ‘My sister,’ where then is my hope – who can see any hope for me? (So many think that death has fathered them and is their salvation! But not so Job.)

Bildad: 18:5 The truth remains that if you do not prosper, it is because you are wicked.

Job: 19:3 Ten times now you have declared me a sinner.

Job: 19:25 But as for me [Job] I know that my Redeemer lives …this body shall see God. Then He will be on my side. Yes, I shall see Him, not as a stranger, but as a friend! What a glorious hope!

Eliphaz: 22:4 Is it because you are good that He is punishing you? Not at all! It is because of your wickedness! Your sins are endless!

Job: 23:10 He knows every detail of what is happening to me; and when He has examined me, He will pronounce me completely innocent – as pure as solid gold!

Bildad: 25:4 How can a mere man stand before God and claim to be righteous?

Job: 27:2 I vow… that as long as I live …my lips shall speak no evil… I will never, never agree that you are right; until I die I will vow my innocence. I am not a sinner – I repeat it again and again. My conscience is clear for as long as I live.

Job: 29:14 …righteousness was my clothing.

Job: 31:35 Look, I will sign my signature to my defence; now let the Almighty show me that I am wrong; let Him approve the indictments made against me by my enemies.

32:1 The three men refused to reply further to Job because he kept insisting on his innocence. Then Elihu became angry because Job refused to admit he had sinned and to acknowledge that God had just cause for punshing him.

Elihu: 32:11 I have waited all this time … but not one of them has convinced Job that he is a sinner, or has proved that he is.

Elihu: 33:8 You have said it in my hearing … again and again. ‘I am pure, I am innocent; I have not sinned.’

Elihu: 34:7 Who else is as arrogant as Job?

God to Eliphaz: 42:8 I am angry with you and your two friends, for you have not been right in what you have said about me, as my servant Job was … and my servant Job will pray for you, and I will accept his prayer on your behalf, and won’t destroy you as I should because of your sin [which they insisted on they have] your failure to speak rightly concerning my servant Job.

How did Job overcome his friend's (acting as the accuser here) accusations and ended up being blessed so outrageously by God again? By having a clear conscience before God and men, by clothing himself with righteousness, and casting down the arguments and speculations of proud men against the knowledge of God’s own righteousness, goodness and kindness [shown toward men in Christ Jesus].

Job stood firm on his knowledge of God, the rock of his salvation.

Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb [slain before the foundations of the earth], and by the word of their testimony [again and again and not agreeing with the accuser]; and they loved not their lives unto the death [even though He slay me, I KNOW THAT MY REDEEMER LIVES AND I SHALL SEE HIM IN MY FLESH].

Most of us are at a breaking point: we have run out of our own resources (the inheritance of life that we received at our natural birth). We need healing in our bodies, finances, restoration in relationships… our oil has been depleted… we need life and that in abundance in every area of our lives. And everyone around us, our families, friends, nations, are all in dire need of Abundant God-kind of Life.

We have to understand that what we are contending for is the double portion, which belongs to the eldest son, the First Born! Therefore it is crucial for us to enter fully into the life of Jesus Christ, God Himself. He is the First Born. And then we receive of His fullness all spiritual blessings! Everything! And this is something we have to do ourselves. The Spirit within us bears witness that we are the sons and daughters of our Heavenly Father. As He is, so are we. Clothe yourself with the Righteousness of God. Agree with who and what God says you are. Do it today! The prodigal came to his senses – his right mind, the mind of Christ. Paul says: we have the mind of Christ. Have you come to your right mind, yet?

Colossians 1:15 -23 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behaviour. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard and that has been proclaimed to every creature under heaven, and of which I, Paul, [and I, Annalize Mouton], have become a servant.


Scripture quotations mainly from The Living Bible

Illustration: from William Blake's Illustrations of the Book of Job

Saturday, 29 March 2014

The Facebook Forum

Chris Welch
Imagine how painful Peter James and John would find it relating the Transfiguration on Facebook. Half would claim they were trying to appear spiritual. Michael Hardin would call them gnostics. The scientists would all point to some illusory state caused by psychosis. How hard it has made things now everyone looks out of eyes which mirror bitter and hardened hearts.

Like · · Share · 13 hours ago ·
Chucky Head and Elaine Pedersen like this.

Michael O'Hara "Then answered Peter, and said to Jesus, 'Lord, it is good for us to be here online with you: if you will, let us build here three websites; one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah."
12 hours ago · Like

Chris Welch In Jesus day He had the overview to see He was building lives with Himself...not buildings. Is such a thing possible online? The disciples had all sorts of form of Word coming at them including ,where necessary rebuke....this generation online dont or ...See More
9 hours ago · Like

Chris Welch In Jesus day He had the overview to see He was building lives with Himself...not buildings. Is such a thing possible online? The disciples had all sorts of form of Word coming at them including ,where necessary rebuke....this generation online dont or cant or perhaps are worth more than mere black and white lettering....so anyway we're at an impasse. There is no church online....only a tarty community that tries to be nice to each other....but there is no thirdlevel church offline either yet. One is limited by the media. Offline is limited by paucity of mature Word that Jesus gave. And nope.. I currently have no answer. But clearly without worship and seeing each other move in that context any form of deeper relating is viewed as completely skewy..with a similar accuracy level of perception as an 8year old boy considering why he would ever kiss a girl and get married. People are visual and first Jesus then 12 disciples in Acts 2 modelled their believing......their new consciousness. Doesnt really work online
9 hours ago · Like · 1

Michael O'Hara It IS a "social media" and it's hard to escape that cultural atmosphere. I've been on a few subjects over the years whereby those on it seemed anointed and we sort of "clicked" but very few in many years. Sometimes we are called to speak word (s) and leave it there but we get pulled into a discussion and lose the clarity. (Heavens like Paul said "I am the chief of sinners" in that capacity.
7 hours ago · Like

Chris Welch I have often compared this section of my life to Paul's time in the forum expounding "his gospel". He never did it that way again. I don't think I will. But what it gives you is an extreme crash course in how different people believe. None of us set out to start huge rucouses, we only see our corner on truth. Paul's corner on truth has outlasted every other historical empire as yet because 1. it plumbs the depth of who humans really are and who they are not.2.it lays a foundation of Christ's actual Person and 3.the vehicle which is the only one sanctioned by God to properly propagate the message: THE CHURCH made up of local churches of sold out individuals to the grace of God.

*********************************
Rich Novek
Your Word is a LAMP to my feet And a LIGHT to my path. Psalm 119:105

A lamp is not a flood light, neither is it a 100,000 candle power flashlight. Christ IN us as our lamp provides just enough light to our feet to take the next step.

How else would we ever know what it means to walk by (His) Faith and not our sight?

Like · · Share · 10 hours ago · Edited ·
Breck Rubin, Emmanuel Rendas, Betty Lorine Schwabedissen and 14 others like this.
4 shares

Christie Trabazo Gibson Amen Amen & Amen
10 hours ago · Like · 1

Lori Rockriver Amen
9 hours ago · Like · 1

Merle Rutherfoord-Jones Love it Rich it makes such sense
4 hours ago · Like · 1

Breck Rubin To see Him leading the Way as Provider.
about an hour ago · Like

Chris Welch Here's another difference. The reference to light in the gospels is the one about setting it on a stand...it is not to be hidden. Now in the Spirit I can see two completely different uses of the Light.
For one set of people it is all about having enough light in this world of darkness to be able to function in our agendas. Have a job,a good living, a good house, a good car, pay our taxes...some to relax with....and just to achieve these things requires some Light to get around with. This however is like using a lamppost to see up your driveway. if you are that worried about your driveway, I would suggest a houselight. At least that would be more honest.
The Light of God is a HIGHWAY. It is a HIGHWAY of HOLINESS.
The Light of God is to put out all Darkness on the Earth for all time.For this reason was the Son of God manifest to destroy all the works of the evil one."
It is a totally different agenda.
One person uses Light to just about get by.
The other person sees the Light and believes Jesus words
"The Gates of hell shall not prevail against my congregation."

While I was working this morning I had this phrase go through my brain
"LADIES CIRCLE" CHURCH
Church that satisfies all our homely requirements and keeps the ladies happy.
It is a totally different form of church to the one espoused in the book Wild At Heart by John Eldredge.
I think the Union Crowd are a bit of a Ladies Circle Church.
Fred Pruitt puts up a few roaring lion noises every so often.
I suppose many men long decided about Facebook as a social medium it is a ladies's domain and what else can be expected.
I'm only on here and my blog because any realworld environment was completely closed until 2008.
It comes as agreat shock to me as a bloke who wrote off Facebook from the start as not for us guys....that I'm on here.
Well we've had a bash. But the power of the Jezebel spirit here disguised as kindly women with beaming faces, is pretty strong, and already the men are beginning to look like emaciated waifs who dare not speak above the Politically Correct speech of the Ladies Circle. Even if our generation never make it, and I intend to.....the next generation down will see straight through these women and the result of their version of Gospel Lite. LIGHT.
See LIGHT has a 12 tribe spectrum. And for ladies it is enough for there to be a 6 tribe core agreement. I don't know if it's a man type thing. It DOES SEEM TO BE A THIRDLEVEL THING...but the only ladies I know that can handle anything like 12 tribes worth of spectrum are already in all Christian bookstores.
people like Corrie Ten Boom. Mother Basilea Schlink. Mother Teresa. Whether they can articulate it properly or not, it does seem that built into man's ribcages is the FULL KINGDOM spectrum. Whenever you see churches of largely female congregants, you should steel your self as soon as you enter, especially if you are the one preaching. Hidden behind those welcoming smiles the reason will soon become apparent as the spirit of Jezebel attacks you full on to try and pare down your gospel to creepy crawly worm size, instead of the threshing sledge that is in your chestcavity. BEWARE BEWARE O MAN the LADIES CIRCLE CHURCH.
27 minutes ago · Like

Rich Novek Too late Chris, most Christian men have been completely emasculated by the lie, so what's the alternative?
16 minutes ago · Like

Chris Welch shopwindow mannequins!!!

Chris Welch I actually don't have a problem with women not handling all tribes worth of material, because perhaps that is the wisdom of God in order that they be what they are good at. My problem with women is when their collective agenda closes down the work of God as it advances in this generation. Nowhere is this more apparent to me than in those having the closest gospel to the one in the Bible, namely the Union crowd. Because none of them have the vision of the Church, we are condemned to this slow drip drip, decade long advance. And largely for no other reason than those of this generation who were quicker at picking up Norman Grubb's discoveries happened to be women...but they never completed the job. It seems to be outside the scope of what they can handle or imagine.
49 minutes ago · Like

Chris Welch A good way of discovering what women want in a man is to look at eunuchs or gay men. In the UK we have a fashion stylist called Gok Wan. As he is gay and interested in clothes and high street life, he is the archetype of all that women would seem to want in their males. Kind of like a plaything. A fount of relevant female information. Absolutlely no threat of hankypanky as that is the last thing he wants to do with women!!!

It's very similar online. Christian women want these playthings. Furry little purveyors of Biblical insight and knowhow, plus someone to pray with them in the problems of the week or the odd real crisis's. For years this has been their relationship with pastors. In no unreal sense has it been a scapegoat for their own spouse who is often perceived as a farting, snoring, skiddie producing person who does supply some of the house income, but also has this annoying insight into the psychology of the wife, and she just isn't interested because some of it at least could be negative. So in churches everywhere, the glamourpussies avert their gaze to pastors like Joel Osteen or other Joseph Prince doe eyed candy...especially when they repeat the glorious childhood food of Romans 3 to 5 on a weekly basis. You can see it is infinitely more pleasurable.

But none of it is covenantal relationship. It's brush back my locks Gok Wan, relating.
32 minutes ago · Like

Chris Welch So in short, has facebook worked? Well it is surprising what we have been able to share in only 4 to 6 years, which up until then was absolutely impossible in the larger world, which is so entrenched in the Genesis 3 lie from the atheist in one corner right through to a church as prophetic as Havant and IHOP and Toronto Vineyard and Bethel,Redding.
Are there drawbacks? Yes. Like the manger in the stable, and born with no human proof of a Father...this was not ideal humanly speaking for Jesus when He began ministering. So in the same way, a social medium largely perceived as a gossiphouse for women, isn't the ideal venue for credibility for rolling out the Royal Highway of Galations 2:20 living. Especially when the agenda of most Christian women is spiritually speaking at least (And I have not had any of the other kind...so I must really speak clearly here to protect others) non covenantal. Apart from ladies such as Annalize Mouton who recognise the seriousness of what the Body of Christ is, most other christian women haven't a clue. They are in it for themselves and their small parochial eyed view of the world. The exceptions are magnificent. Like Elaine Waterfield. Most Christian women today just weren't around for when God was rolling out the covenantal vison of Church as community in the 70s. It's a glorified coffeehouse, and Facebook is absolutely superb for breeding this view of what Christian relating is. In the week that I have heard of a man drop dead in the UK after deliberately not heeding an apostolic Word, can I just say that this whole idea of men as Christian playthings is not just false, it could prove deadly. The Bible puts it this way "rightly discern the Body of Christ...for in not doing so are many now sick and some have even died." We are dealing with the House of God. Whether a manger, or Facebook is ultimately the best vehicle...it is the House of God we are dealing with.

Friday, 14 September 2012

Facebook Interrogation : How was Church for you?

Here are a selection of Church and meeting related conversations all on Facebook in the past few hours.
Obviously a hot topic.



Paul Noble
Some people are not going to like this very much but I'm going to say it anyway: talking to or with other Christians on Facebook & even on the phone is not church.

Why? Jesus isn't present + your not gathering together in Jesus name.

Now I may be wrong but if you look at what Jesus says there are three qualifications for ecclesia or assembly or church.

(1) You have to be at least two people.


(2) You are gathered together or assembled (physically I believe)
(3) Its done in Jesus in JESUS name which simply means your gathered FOR him not yourselves. So christians together down the pub isn't necessarily church - but it could be! Christians gathered together "at church" may not be church either by the way if the reason they are gathering is not really for Jesus.

Matt 18 :20For 1063 where 3757 two 1417 or 2228 three 5140 are 1526 gathered together 4863 in 1519 my 1699 name 3686, there 1563 am I 1510 in 1722 the midst 3319 of them 846.

Anyway thats my take!
Like ·
  • Paul Noble By the way I'm not saying Facebook and all the other things is bad or wrong I thing they are great but I think we need to keep to the BIble. In Hebrews it says don't forsake meeting together!
  • Eliya Ferguson I agree in part, however You have not taken into consideration those who are housebound and can't get to church, those for whom going to church is a huge risk and in this day where Christians are being slaughtered in some nations I think that condemning those who do Facebook church or phone church as something second class is unfair.
    Also, starting a post with you're not going to like this but I'll say it anyway shows no grace whatsoever.
  • Paul Noble Hey hold on .... I'm not talking about getting "to church" ... Paul & Silas in prison are a good example of both your objections ... but I'm provoking a bit and as graciously as I'm able but scripture stands and my point as well (i I'm right).
  • Eliya Ferguson Paul and silas were in prison together so not such a good example. Jesus used whatever was available to him. If he was here now I'm sure he'd have Facebook church.

Chris Welch: There really is no "solution",well, in a leftbrain sense to the perennial conundrum in the church of "going out" and preaching the gospel...and "going in to your inner room" or going monastic or "mystic". Fact is...Jesus was both...but only after spending an intense 30 years of finding His identity. Most new Christians have spent all their lives doing the opposite, so find they are detoxing.


Like · · ·
  • Chris Welch The monastery answer is probably overkill.The church should have a culture of changed consciousness....but they don't, so we have to start where everyone still is, which is preaching teaching praying and worshipping in "separation" as if Genesis 3 hadn't ever changed. Jesus however took a scruffy bunch of nobodies through into consciousness WHILE holding down a ministry to a multitude alongside his disciples....which is as far from monastic as you can get!!! Pop evangelists today fake it, by trying to impose Kingdom realities over the top of Genesis 3 cages, and hope no one notices. Ofcourse...the problem is prophets and creatives notice everything...so their solution to them is to throw them in cages and carry on preaching a half-assed attempt at a gospel of works.
Frances N. MyGene Ashcroft
  • Hello dear ones....I would like to share something on my heart here, and I would sincerely appreciate you to speak the Truth in Love to me regarding what I'm going to say. Okay, here is what's on my heart: More and more lately, I simply don't want "mixture".......and if I may be completely honest here, I sometimes wonder if I've gone WAAAAAAAY over to the EXtreme......What I mean is this > Very possibly I need to be more tolerant when it comes to "church gatherings", whether they are actually in a "church building" or even in someone's home gathering...... I find that when it comes to "getting together" for any "church" kind of purpose, I get so skeptical. It's like I have an antenna up........and I'm always wondering if manipulation and control are subtly lurking in the background... I find that I would rather get together over a meal and then watch Holy Spirit do HIS thing in and through us all, rather then get together for a specific purpose of "having church".........Oh my, .......I'm not sure what's going on in me....I've been invited by some friends to go to "their church" or their "home gathering"...and I've offended several personal friends whom I really do care for, by telling them what I'm sharing here......all I know is I long for CHRIST to flow through us all, I am so longing for the manifestation of the sons of God......and for His Glory, the fullness of CHRIST, to be revealed through us......Please be honest with me, do you sense that I'm being too critical?......or maybe impatient with others?



  • Jim Vissers
    Yesterday
    Jim Vissers
    • Frances, I can not offer any advice or direction here. Just my own feelings. All I can say is that you have expressed our situation precisely. I have been attending a home church on occasion (my wife less often) with people we love dearly and who in many ways have had similar experiences as us with organised church. I think they too are looking for the authentic expression of Christ flowing through us. But I have had a difficult time negotiating these meetings because it seems like there is a tendency to fall back into patterns and formulas. I found I have even fallen into what seemed OK at the time but then have had second thoughts after. It is such a subtle thing because I want to be sensitive the Spirit and I know I don't have the corner on HS. He speaks through all of us. So in that setting I have to allow others room and leave it up to the hosts to choose the direction.

      So how do we get the Spirit without the formulas and expectations. I think it is a matter of realizing we are the Church and we don't have to 'put on' the church when we get together. I feel caught here because I want what others have to offer and love getting together with those who love the Lord. Honestly, I get excited about seeing these people and being with them but I do not get very excited about what happens at the meetings. Maybe the only way to get completely free is to get completely away and wait for others to catch on.

      Now on the other hand we have a few dear friends who we get together with socially. They believe in the same way as us and when we meet it is a blast and an encouragement in the Lord. We don't try "to have a meeting" we just experience communion. We pray for each other and just share stuff. It would be great to see this happen with a larger group. I wonder what a corporate anointing would be like in this simple expression. I don't know if this is the way it is supposed to look. Maybe this is the nucleus of something new or just a waiting and renewing season.





  • Joan Reilly
    Yesterday
    Joan Reilly
    • Hi Frances. I belong to a bible study group. All young women in their thirties. There are around nine of us. I began attending the church that is connected with this bible study a couple year ago. Keep in mind that I hadn't been in a church for over twenty-five years. I was in the message of Union on my own with one friend but didn't entirely grasp the ramifications of Christ in me as me until coming to Gracebook a couple years ago. Well, since then, I can barely stomach church at all. In fact I have quit going altogether. But I've come to love the young women in the bible study and our leader who is in her fifties. When we share and study the Word, I patiently listen and love the girls just as they are. I have complete acceptance of them and where they are in their individual walk with the Lord. However, I cannot keep quiet in my enthusiasm of Oneness and Union with Christ and I speak it out when asked my interpretation of any particular passage. I do not always receive the patient acceptance I put forth and at times I even feel I am a thorn in the side of the leader. I am dismissed as "older" and therefore bitter and burned out in my relationship with God and now He accepts my sacrifice of love as unconditional. However, they feel they want to keep doing what they can to please God by tithing and bible reading and setting aside time to be with God> When I share I am always with God.in face In God, they just gaze into thin air and wonder what I am talking about. I love them still, but am expecting to be invited to leave at any time in the near future.

      I don't think we can soft peddle this Truth. Jesus didn't try to be kind to the religious leaders of His day. He spoke plainly and they wanted to kill him. I think we need to speak plainly as He wishes and leads from our insides. (Chris's word "insides" lol)





  • Joan Reilly
    Yesterday
    Joan Reilly
    • In fact In God





  • Éilís Liberty
    Yesterday
    Éilís Liberty
    • I hear ya ... i havent been going to church for the past few months. it was not a deliberate decision but circumstantial due to my car accident in june. i went to a bible study on revelation more often than not and probably went to a service 2 or 3 times all summer long. heres what i found when i went. i disagree with the seperation. god is with me always. i dont have to work to go get him. i dont have to strive to obtain his company, hes right here with me. i am already his and as his vessel, he fills me. i get annoyed hearing it too much yet i understand that newbie christians who said the prayer may need some direction on how to get close to God or spend some alone time with him or how often they should read their bible. Yet i know we all are where we are in our walk with him. so for some, this may be excellent guidance for how to come to know God intimately. i also am of the opinion that the pastor(s) of my church are not responsible for my relationship with God so i dont think i expect much anyway.





  • Éilís Liberty
    Yesterday
    Éilís Liberty
    • It is difficult to listen to some stuff n think, thats just wrong.





  • Cathy Rheeder
    Yesterday
    Cathy Rheeder
    • Hi Beloved's, I've read through your posts! I'm feeling the same way! Irritated in church! They're not awakened yet! Sure I love them all! Fran u are really right! I'm going thro the same here! Love to u all!





  • Facebook Friend
    • Ditto Fran. I stop attending church regularly years back. The Holy Spirit spoke in my ear very clearly to leave asap. I have learned so much lately since leaving. But it was not the actual attending that stunted my growth, it was what I was hearing and believing. I would fall under law and works and condemnation everytime I attended. Soon, I would be sick at the teachings that my baby sisters and brothers were taking in. It was like I was seeing a baby being fed poison and I stood by and did nothing. I was not strong enough to stay and Father knew that. I was feeding myself more guilt. I loved my brothers and sisters in Christ and miss the joy of seeing them and being together. I am just starting to get my daughter in wed. night program.... not sure on that one... she seems to be already speaking law. I have tried several churches and bible studies and yes it seems like law, numbers, image, position, or merchandising is always in the mix. Left pretty empty from sermons maybe some great motivational tidbits to improve my self or finances or image. , but filled with joy when gathering with those who love Christ. In my honest opinion, I believe it is so important to listen to the Holy Spirit during these times. There is no telling who God will use where and when. If God wants someone in the midst of this setting he will protect their ears and eyes and give them purpose for his body and it will produce fruit for others to see. I have learned that a body has all parts, a foot and hand will never see, an ear will not walk, a finger does not speak, the eyes will see, the ears hear, the feet walk, the hands touch, the heart liver ....etc are keeping things moving on the inside.... and the mind knows and controls it all. If the mind is Christ and the body abides it flows. If that which is controlling the body is not the mind of Christ then it is something else and the foot can be fooled into being hand, or an eye into being a foot.... and the body does not function fully and can do more to damage the body then grow it to perfection. Sometimes just one small voice spoken from the mind of Christ helps the foot realize its a foot and function fully for the body, and the eyes realize they can see and so on.... someone may be called to be that voice. Whether doing Gods work within a religious organization or the local park or job or park or doctors office.... its still doing what God has called one to do. I couldn't be a nurse for my weak stomach, but somebody else could and go into sickly situations and not be phased and they wouldn't ignore it and take precautions so that they did not get infected.... they would be strong and bring healing. So in all my rambling.... I can not regularly visit an organization or gathering that is top heavy and being taught poison at this time. i would do more damage to myself and others. If and when God calls me I will know it. But believe some are given that calling and have peace about it. I was given many signs that I was not that person I followed that lead. I have more sorrow now, at first I had anger and bitterness, now I know it is all in his hands and he has given me good christian friends to fill so many needs for fellowship. And yes.... just the gathering with others to eat, pray, or watch a movie or study the scripture is so helpful. I want to be the church not go to it. I want to gather as a church not gather to a church. I can be hard and works deep down and causes the spirit to bring out things that were so hidden. I also found my relationship with my Lord in a much deeper way since leaving. Hope this makes sense.




  • Annalize Mouton
    Yesterday
    Annalize Mouton
    • It is about a very real, very intimate relationship with our Abba Father, knowing Him, His ways, His voice and leading, resting in the victory and glory of His Word made Flesh, being fully engaged with Father and our spiritual reality, where our Father works and because of that we work. We only do and say what we see and hear our Father doing and seeing. I believe this is a time of "coming away" with the Lord, pressing into all of Him and let Him do His work in our hearts, because He wants to present us to the world as His fully mature sons whom He has paced in His body (not the church organizations) but the place in Him which He had prepared for everyone of us from the beginning before even the foundations of the earth was laid!!!

      I have been out of organised religion for almost 15 years now, and could never ever go back to it. But, that has never been what Father was about!!! We have to come out from Babylon, confusion and double-speaking and worldly teachings and desire the pure milk and the meat. And the meat according to jesus is doing the will of the Father only, ever!





  • Annalize Mouton
    Yesterday
    Annalize Mouton
    • I would urge you – everyone of you to fully trust Him who is now our life. We have no other life – our only life is that of the eternal Son of God, Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour. He will never lead us astray. We are raised from the dead along with Christ and seated with him in the heavenly realms because we are united (one spirit) with Christ Jesus. Trust Him and go where he leads you!!!!!! He is within you and like with Elizabeth and Mary He within you will "jump" when in the presence of Jesus Christ within others. Make them your companions for now! And when He comes forth of full age/maturity within all of us, He Himself will do the greater works and people will come to the light and life streaming from without you, and say: hey, we want to go with you, because we have seen that God is with you!!!!!!!

      Chris Welch:So to summarise,this new way of seeing on our insides turns the old way of seeing upside down. Many Christians have indeed asked Jesus into their hearts. There is no doubt and the love that is in God shows...but really apart from that,the way they live is still Genesis 3 unchecked. Actually very little has changed, and many realise,if pressed, they actually "hate" themselves.
      Like · ·
      • Chris Kimmell likes this.
      • Paul Noble Thats cos they don't understand Christ in them - Paul added a very important qualification when he spoke in Romans 7 when he said no good dwells in me ( that is in my flesh). Many christians are looking in the wrong place!
      • Chris Welch We're not preaching some new fad that will go away in a few years...no, the third level is the very thing Jesus promised :1.If you abide in My Word 2. You shall know the Truth....of how Genesis 3 works and turns everything inside out,the wrong way round, and 3. And that very Truth shall set you free. Our very new found freedom will, and already is, finding you out. We don't like your meetings. We don't like the way you pray. We don't like the "heavy" way you practice your Christianity and then burden everyone else with your overworked systems. To know Jesus is to know Life. It's that Life that sets us free.
      • Paul Noble As long as your preaching Christ crucified then your on track anything else is a false gospel. Nothing is ever new just hidden. Thats why Christ in You the hope of glory is a mystery.
      • Chris Welch Good comment Paul...mine crossed with yours
      • Paul Noble I'm just excited about the whole new birth thing because its really the core of what Jesus did & yet we skate over it at 100mph and get on to the gifts of the Holy Spirit Etc like the charismatics not realising that its abut maturity (christ being revealed in the church) Ephesians. Yes we are to eagerly seek his gifts (thats where the evangelicals lag behind) but the sad thing is they don't appreciate righteousness either making it all so technical and boring!
      Chris Welch:We are a brand new Order. We do not function by "remote control".
      We live from the Son of Man within. There's a difference between the Orders.
      Like · ·
      • Sammy Bilyeu You got that right Chris!
      • Martha Gisela Domínguez beautiul, thank you!
      • Chris Welch Bet you're not remote controlled Sammy :-)
      • Chris Welch Jesus wasn't baptised in water to turn from sin....but to fulfil all righteousness....and this is the difference between Old and New Covenants. The one refers to sin....continually...the other creates a priesthood and "fulfils ALL RIGHTOUSNESS". Boy, I'm gonna stick with the New Order eh? To have the Fulfiller of ALL righteousness actively living IN US!!!! You kiddin? Why would I hang around anything else?
        2 hours ago · Like · 1

         Daniel Yordy
         You stirred up a good discussion, Frances. I really appreciate the heart in what everyone shares. 
        There is a real desire for the true gathering together of church life because that is Christ and that's who we are. Yet for some reason we can't find what our hearts long for. The problem is that, knowing that Christ is our life, when we hear the other stuff, now, it sounds so awful. I can't stand most churches, not because we do not love the brethren, but because Christ Himself is not their gathering. For some amazing reason, we have found Lakewood church as a place that gives us life and encouragement and uplifting. Joel and Victoria, though they don't see the whole picture, always point in the right direction - Christ without limitations. But I would switch in a moment if God would raise up the fellowship our hearts long for. Blessings to all.