Born again in the Holiest Place

 

I was alive in the 60s . If you have seen Jesus Revolution film 2023 you catch an American view of what was going on suddenly late 60s and early 70s . We were in UK and it was even less polarised round one main figure , or a handful.  Old legacy churches had congregation members getting born again and baptised in the Spirit . There was the Jesus Move in their teens and 20s . Graham Cooke I just found out was  converted in David and Kathie Walters house . But whether walking the street or in a Brighton Cinema Queue , or watching a Billy Graham film at an Amersham youth outreach centre followed by a Holy Spirit organised Day training event , the Spirit of God was Sovereignly moving . We were building upon Pentecostalism but our generation wanted to live this stuff , not forever hold meetings or do street outreach .
What could be our Message? We only knew Day One stuff and if anybody asked about living here and now , we couldn't say . We were teens and the people before us only knew about salvation ,deliverance and healing.
Gerald Coates and John Noble wanted to know about being supernaturally natural .
All this to say though .....there was a clear Move of God . In the 60s certain bishops were denying miracles, the Virgin Birth and even the resurrection of Jesus . In the 70s we were too busy praying for  people and seeing things happen , to notice or even care what Anglicans didn't get up to .

What our psalm 24 seeking generation didn't appreciate was such a deep answer to the question . How many like me  have been down to the dregs , to learn the power of sin as we live upon the Genesis 3 platform?
We may be born again in our spirit main person , but unless we set our minds on that new spirit person and our new reality,  instead of slipping back into the false delusion of the self powered front of house soul -I.....we have a few big ouches to learn .

God said through Juan Carlos Ortiz around 1974 that in the future people would be born again in the Holiest Place . Well apart from St Paul and François DuToit ( Mirror Bible ) pointing out that that is so .....Im a child of the Jesus Move .
We were aware of what is true for us now in the Holy Spirit . François can say what he likes as doctrine but in Acts 2 this is what happened....
A fully built ecclesia was presented in its full Tabernacles / Community/ City on a Hill context.
120 and the 12 had seen Jesus after resurrection,  a bit like Elisha they had seen Jesus ascend.
They spent the next 10 days confessing their faults to one another ....not least their part in letting God the Second Person in human form be crucified in front of them and they did nothing about it .
(  Very similar to what family members have done to their offspring while the fourth quartiles were all screaming at them .....dont take those vaccines . Use HCQ and Ivermectin . Don't let people use Remdesivir on your family and friends.  And you actively refused the real information coming at you live from alert family and all over the internet )

Acts 2 had real mighty rushing wind
Real loud praises up the streets .
Real cloves of fire upon the heads
Real unknown languages being spoken
(At my baptism, Corinne , another girl baptised
with me spoke in Polish . A Polish speaking one time visitor translated what she said )
Then the agape love was so powerful people really shared what they owned .

It was Third level ( 1 John 2 Father stage leadership )
It was the Spirit version of Tabernacles as live fellowship house to house breaking of bread and apostolic doctrine .
Outstanding miracles.
It was the Holiest Place because it was Open Heaven Revival Presence  and the two aspects of the Holiest Place is normal holy living ....symbolised by the grained wood acacia box holding the three manifest forms of Word
And ofcourse
The mighty deeds which is represented by the Khavod accompanying glory .

It was great of Jesus to give us another of His key first mentions.  First mentions in the Bible contain all the DNA of later full glory mentions .

Nobody can say thirdlevel ecclesia can't happen everywhere because it's already happened somewhere !!!

And the Jesus Move have all shared early versions and you can't fob us off with pyramid church run by king pastors and tell us that a teaching synagogue is the same as Revival Presence church.  You are liars and we have already been there in smaller versions .

Ecclesia Paul writes in 1 Corinthians 12, has THREE DIVERSES. Really good 5 day conferences already know this ......but this IS LOCAL CHURCH ....not something we have to wait all year for .

If we abide in God's Word we know the truth about the ugliness of the Genesis 3 platform and the glory of the Heavens God has rebirth us into ....and this releases a raft of fully free people.

And these free people Daniel says , in the last times shall run to and fro throughout the earth shining like the stars.

Discipleship Groups

 People go to a church even a Pentecostal one with set expectations.

There's the head man .

There's the service we pay for .

Any change is disruptive .

Half a century ago we were getting excited about discipleship. In order to do it Juan Carlos Ortiz had to secretly take 12 aside .

Then came the discipleship books .

Then came the home groups.

Jesus Move did the house churches then they grew into self standing visible churches .

But we still have a problem. And mainly it's that there's three stages of growth and charismatics are still in denial about 1 John 2, and the inner work of Romans 6 and 7.

That's what Watchman Nee Normal Christian Life and Sit Walk Stand attempted .

Norman Grubb did a better more accurate version without the black and white dog. Readers will get this .

GH Warnock brought out the ecclesia aspect and moving through the three Feasts in the Spirit .

So that's the real " discipleship dilemma ".

People haven't lived Bible House ...the cheek by jowl learning of the disciples in the gospels.

How much do those running Bible House community houses know Galatians 2.20 and Mark 16 supernatural praying in ministry?

The 12 learned whole of Life living in the Father and ministry in the Spirit from Jesus .

Roffey and Colin Urquart and Bob Gordon attempted both using Kings Buses and ' students ' who were with them to learn .

As soon as you say the student word that comes with Geeek learning baggage.

Kingdom is zöe. It has a whole of Life Galatians 2.20 side ....and it has a priesthood side.

Our generation felt embarrassed by those who said we should be evangelising more.

It does seem to be a window thing .

Moravians prayed 100 years .....I bet they were criticised. Jesusc.....that's God in human form ....the One who co created everything....spent 30 years not evangelising.

This shows how deep was the 4000 year reset after the Fall , for Jesus to be grounded in living in the Father when everybody else was doing Genesis 3 lie living.

But it's also Testimony of the subtlety of Satan's wrath state lie .....if it took God that long in human form .

So we are a royal priesthood.

We are king overcomers in training .

We are trainees in a priestly protocol of bringing in the reign of God.

The rather flippant thing called House groups or cell groups.....a kind of Methodist class meeting updated to charismatic sessions .....it's still nowhere near what ecclesia is .

I don't know what others feel....but evangelists now return to the original gospel of repentance, baptism in water and being filled with the Spirit .

Pastor gifts.....not the one man overlord misuse of the word......are plural and have the gifting to bed people into the Romans truths .

Do pastors have the ability take people in the Spirit from Romans 3 to 5 into Romans 6 and 7?

What we found was the most enormous hidden key areas of lives ....my own included .....would come right to the surface hopefully in a safe environment. Since ....as the circumcised Penis is the Old Covenant logo ....quietly telling us Romans 6 and 7 is a scary area .....because its the raw seat of our desires .....not just sex by the way

Raw desires to dominate

Raw desires to make money at all cost....Judas syndrome

Just put Raw in front of anything you can think of. Its force is frightening. Debilitating in force .

But this is how we learn firsthand what the Genesis 3 lie is . That there's only 2 masters .

The third doesn't exist spiritually. Me in the middle.

That's why , although we have to go through the Holy place realm , the transition realm , the Pentecostal Charismatic realm ....it is still fake .

I don't hear charismatic ministries off the middle man delusion .

When Lyall Peluso was teaching Romans 6 40 years ago it was almost received as a heretic gospel. We had to go to Brighton to hear him .

Third level sounds heretical because our consciousness is 6000 years of conditioning into the independent self powered soul living for Christ .

Nope....there's a whole unnecessary layer in that theology .

The separate me .

There never was a separate me. The Devil me .

Jesus me . But never in 6000 years me me .

There's no me living for Christ . The whole charismatic belief system is a lie .

There's no adding the Holy Spirit to my life lived for Jesus .

People complain....I'm living my life for the Lord but all these things are happening.

We aren't meant to be living our life for the Lord since our funeral. Its scary seeing a ghost live for Jesus .

We are spirit.

We have a soul .

Our former spiritman was sold under sin .

Think of Genesis 3 as a cross between a Freemason oath and a slave sale at an old market .

We can choose a new master , but the sale has been made . Our soul and spirit has an indwelling yukky tyrant spirit . We in Adam signed the agreement in the one forbidden fruit .

Jesus annulled the deal by killing us in His Body and raising us as a rope twined , interlaced Colossians 3.3 being .

We aren't living for Jesus at all . Christ is living co- fused to our spirit man in one of four Matthew Mark Luke John or Meyers Briggs 16 blend flavours. When we pray in tongues our real inner person is praying without the rude butler who claims to be the lord of the manor but he's mere serving staff ....my natural mind .

When Paul says we must set the mind on the Spirit for that is life and peace, it's because that's the real us . Its not just some religious woo woo practice.

To set the mind on the flesh if you put it onto a graph, with a vertical line up the middle which is God's life ......well flesh is either to the left of the line or the right side of the line .....but it's not what God is actually doing.

Religion is the Tree of Good but it's still the delusion of the independent self living for God in various orphan appeasement ways .

The other side is the Evil end of the Tree but that's obvious .

All this is discipleship.

It's related to 1 John 2 child stage young man stage father stage

It's related to the Seal .....the Father knowing , having intimate relation with all of us and with us departing from iniquity . Iniquity is the Deep 6000 year hold on us ....freed in spirit in New Birth but our souls haven't made the adjustments.

It's related to the last 3 stages of MScott Pecks four stages of psychological growth

It's related to Maslows hierarchy of needs....except genuine kinging in the Spirit not just an earthly ability to create pyramid shapes with us at the top.

It's related to psalm 84....

finding our strength in Him

In whose hearts are the highway to Jesus central

Proven track record with places of weeping turned round

Recognised in the spirit in front of God and man .

See what I mean by flippant little groups?

Jesus was building City on a Hill that actually worked .

There is currently no City on a Hill ecclesia holding open heaven over a place .

We can just about arrange a few months of Lakeland or Asbury ....usually outside the City Gates of pyramid infrastructure

Or

5 day conferences which begin to look similar.

But there aren't enough thirdlevellers yet , and even when the Ern Baxters emerge they aren't used to miracles. The 12 apostles were doing the whole stuff because Jesus also had the 30 year background.

Juan Carlos Ortiz prophesied of a Holiest Place generation

 I've never done more than 6 weeks in the evangelical thing . Nearly none of the Jesus Move have . Many in the Jesus Move went from Enlightenment raised atheism and humanism and crashed through two states into what is , in the heavenly tabernacle the second room experience  .. ..the Holy place .

So I honestly don't know what trying to do a going into your inner room thing is like as an evangelical .

The point of tongues , the point of the release of the Holy Spirit , is to zap you into the reality of these things . That was why Jesus suffered so badly and then was able to give everybody the three keys through Peter .

Repent .

Be baptised in water 

Be filled with the Spirit 

Today's Move of God like Juan Carlos Ortiz prophesied , does the full Ephesians hit !!!!

See , as it says in Ephesians ....Jesus never raised us in Christ and left us in an ante room , saying " ok wait just there , I'll see you later ".

He didn't plonk us in the Outer Courts with an ice cream .

He didn't put us in the holy place with some Bethel Redding earbuds . " Just sit right there and enjoy the Charismatic level ,while I just have fellowship with the 24 elders ".

No , Jesus raised us in Himself and has us seated with Him in the heavenly places .

One of the reasons we are baptised in the Spirit with fire and given the gift of tongues is because our poor Tavistock BBC occult mind is so far out of the loop , and having to catch up , God connects our spirit right away to accelerate us in Himself .

If baptism in the Spirit drove the normal Jews who didn't believe in Jesus as the Son of God nuts ....think what they felt about complete outsiders who had never done their 1700 years or whatever since Abraham .....Corinthians , Asia Minor people , Romans ..... No nothings spiritually from a Jewish standpoint .

We don't know what that's really like , but we do know what dynasty's of State Anglicans thought of us in the Jesus Move . We were teens and we were telling them .....them ...them.......about Christ .

Bishops , ordained Religious Instruction teachers , Anglican raised kids and adults . I'd not had much to do with Catholics until Germany . Anglicans were bad enough . And as for the Methodists I was raised with .....they didn't like me at all .

The Holy Spirit is given to 

Convict us of sin , righteousness and judgment .

He is given us to be our Comforter , our military strengthener , our relating Friend , our Indwelling God .

He is our Teacher .

He is sent to lead us into all Truth so we don't go down spiritual cul de sacs.

He teaches us how to pray . He helps us in our weakness with groans and utterances too deep for words . If we ask anything in Jesus Name , conformed to His Person , it will be done for us .

Having been inside the worldwide tribe who took church from the firstlevel to the secondlevel I already had to ' leave ' my earthly family once .

I didn't leave geographically until later , but people like Benny Hinn and myself knew what it was like to even be in the same house as others , while part of that generation relocating church on earth .

We and the current Move of God are doing what Juan Carlos Ortiz prophesied . In the last 40 years we are moving the church kicking and screaming from the secondlevel ,the Pentecostal then charismatic church of the last 100 years , back into Acts .And two of the key indicators are 

Addressing 1 Corinthians 12 : 14-26 head on , so we have the knowledge of the Book Surrounded by Idiots , except now in a Body of Christ and Tabernacles 4 Woods context ....

Addressing the Jerusalem Gate 10 of Nehemiah called Miphkad . Which means when we go out on fishing trips we nolonger try to be the lone Marvel Comic Super guy bringing in the biggest nets ....but we are prepared for that Samaritan , MKUltra dynasty family witch who like John 4 , we are asking to draw water for us .

Gate of Miphkad means relearning church completely without a king .

Because we have a Melchizedek king priest called Jesus .

In the third level we don't do rabbi synagogues any more . We do 1 John 1 Church .

We are a Gate , a Core of loving elders who have crossed the 1 Corinthians 12 : 14 -26 dysfunction barrier into Body homeostasis .

Do you know our body has about 24 parallel systems listed by Martin Felt in his 1990 book the Felt Formula .

This was written before the great upsurge in knowledge about prebiotics and probiotics and the gut biome wasn't even a phrase .

Thirdlevel Church is arriving on Platform 9 3/4 in your very city and town .

I hope Bill Johnson  likes it . I hope Stan Warren and all the other Warrens that are left down Thorney Road like it . I hope Bridge Church  and Elim Church and the Catholic Alpha Course priest  Hayling Island  like it .

But when God inspired Joel to write His " In the last days I will pour out My Spirit " prophecies

And 

Ephesians 4 ,St Paul on the Mature Man 

And 

The latter house shall be greater than the former House , Jesus wasn't asking people's permission .

When , in 2014 , God put it in me to pray for these Samaritan women ....and Men ....like Ronald Bernhard .....to emerge from ' the System' , the Illuminati .....Jesus didn't ask my permission or anybody else's permission . He didn't ask Bill Johnson's permission or the permission of Robin D Bullock , Charlie Shamp or Elijah List.

He just said " This is what I'm going to do , pray ".

He said in Isaiah " I will give you the treasures of Darkness ".

At the moment , because these guys were raised in Mengele's Supersoldier Programme , during the period he was Dr Green in Paraguay , and during the Boys of Brazil period .....so many of these guys are clairvoyants and astral projection people , and remote viewers ......I have no idea how the Holy Spirit turns that around .....all I know is that Jesus is  baptising with the Spirit and with fire like He did me and Morris Cerullo and David Hathaway at around 13 and 14.....so Jesus can do this stuff .

He doesn't ask our permission .

If you want another look at what Jesus Kingship means , checkout Psalm 2,because Bill Johnson and Stan Warren seem to think it's about bigger recording studios for earbuds .

Where I am Now on Discipleship

Also in a note on Facebook
Some were discussing recent Juan Carlos Ortiz material that has been posted, then Megan Anne Fey wrote Chris, do you have any good reading on "true discipleship" (Internet materials), the Lord has commissioned me and I would love to read more about it...
Here is what I initially wrote, followed by a longer reply to her question
Allibris is good for Ortiz books. The original was one of those historical confluences of "mismatches" that God is in like Rahab and the spies. Jamie Buckingham was a pastor out of a job because he had fallen in adultery...so he became a writer to the new fledgling baptized in the Spirit Community.Ortiz being Argentinian, needed someone to work ... See morepatiently with him to get the English right!!! So "Call to discipleship" was born. This was the original Spirit format of what later became the shepherding pyramid still visible today, though softened. In the original format, which is what we'd also been led to in England....which is why the book is in my DNA....we learned that Discipleship comes out of relationship, it comes from Holy Spirit prepared "fathers", male or female, and involves feeding the young with stuff as God gives revelation. It is warm, not sterile. It is dependant on people walking in a living relationship with Jesus and it definitely involves a bit of "going to hell" for the people you are being used to feed. What I mean is...you feed with unconditional love...because "reactions" come up and some of the freshly prepared food is thrown back over you. Then as Ed Miller says, "when you've taken the disciples to the throne, just like any good taxi driver you withdraw.
Discipleship is not about Alpha Courses, though they can be used. It is not about manuals. It is not about study groups on a Tuesday evening. You'll find people don't have problems on Tuesday evenings, it will be Wednesday! It's not about mini Sunday services with preprepared speeches in your home. It is not about discipling people to you, or your ... See morechurch. You know when you've succeeded not when they are in your church, but when they know how to live Jesus as them, in their calling. Discipleship is now a dirty word.But a true discipler, as in any ministry, takes on the same role that Joseph had with Mary. He takes all the flack for a babe born out of wedlock, without being the actual father. I'll spell that out. Unlike seminary trained pastors who feel they have earned their position and now "disciple" people into "their ministry" and "their church", a true discipler realises he is discipling people out of a job, with nothing in it for him, while taking all the flack "for being out of wedlock"....that is true Spirit stuff always looks iffy to carnal bystanders who cannot understand what is going on.
++++++++++++
Here is my fuller reply to Megan about what I am feeling now about Discipleship

We are in a singular time period. Corporately, were we to view the parable of building on the sand and building on the rock....we have discovered that we weren't quite on the rock and people all over the world are still digging down to find it. (Understand here I am talking in terms of building the Kingdom of God,personal salvation we have clear.).Apart from individuals like Norman Grubb, Major Thomas and others....Everything, absolutely everything out there that relates to discipleship has a very naive view of what humans are. I don't yet know of a single book that covers discipleship from the bedrock foundation of reversing Genesis 3 by faith in a Christ who wants to live out Our Life as Us. So herein lies the problem.

Nor is there a book that covers discipleship in a way that faithfully honours some of the ways the Holy Spirit has led a whole generation or 3 of people as they have rediscovered the baptism in the Holy Spirit. Living in any sense at all corporately is doomed to failure without an active relationship with the Holy Spirit. To the extent that any of us have lived continuously together as a worshipping community advancing in the knowledge of God, that, from a human perspective has to be a divine miracle. Sin has disconnected us from God and each other at a very core level. For this reason, one of the spin offs of getting to know Jesus better is loving my brother and sister more. This side of discipleship is behind this series of posts which begins here http://080808onnowto.blogspot.com/2009/04/from-mystery-of-sin-to-mystery-of-syn.html and continues via the ”next button” to the 8th post. There’s “How do we live this stuff ?” http://080808onnowto.blogspot.com/2009/06/i-was-encouraged-to-get-message-from.html

The taxi Driver picture of Ed Miller, and my own revelation on Joseph taking on Mary with child are two key foundations to discipleship. They are the two barricades against “Pyramid” building in the Body of Christ. If people took regard to just these two principles half of the present structures would disappear overnight.

Since these posts I have been seeing more clearly what Romans 1:21 means For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

We became effectively locked in our left brains, alienated from God’s life which should be bubbling up actively from within, but is clogged up in shame and hurt, and effectively cut off from God.

So you can see how addressing this problem with mere manuals , however good they are like the YWAM Discipleship manual, cannot change the fifth column in our own make-up. Our own mind filters God out by default!!

There are two models of discipleship or Temple building in the Bible. There is the picture of each stone being prepared beforehand in the quarry, then seamlessly fitted together on the Temple site. This is similar to our own individual daily walks preparing us in Ephesians 4 and 5 fashion, for corporate warfare in Ephesians 6.

The second model is the way the disciples lived with Jesus for 3 years . This model was transplanted in the early churches where people hungrily learned as much as they could from living together, sharing together and attending to what the apostles were bringing of the revelation of the life of Christ. A proto type of this was experienced by ourselves in Emsworth thirty years ago as, as many as 30 lived together in one not too large house.

You notice I do not view discipleship too separately from building the House of the Lord.
The vision of the Church is so powerful, and the love being shared abroad in people’s hearts by the Holy Spirit so intoxicating that others are pretty soon drawn in.

But one of my latest revelations concerning discipleship actually comes from the calling of Moses. This also is one of the most important keys to ministry and discipleship that you will ever hear and we will spend our entire lives exploring this. When Moses asked how God would like to be known when he presented his message of calling Israel out of Egypt, God replied…..”You shall say I AM sent you.”

Think about it. As things stand, when we minister to each other we are sharing the latest doctrine, our own agenda, our own stream. What the Key of David meetings are teaching us to do. What Jorge Pradas’s meetings were all about 30 years ago , was spending time with the I AM. What is the I AM up to today. Transplanting this ability to perceive God’s heart in individuals and churches is far more important and dovetails exactly with the revelation of Christ living out His life as you. They are the training ground which is then exported into the rest of people’s lives.